LLY Overheat Lawsuit Video

[swatkins]

Hopalong just stay with your truck,,, If it gets hot put a V2 on it and go on with life

The rest of the truck is fine

[Rockfollower]

Tx, nice video and congratulations on the $$$$.
I have been following the OH issue here and "there".
I tow around 9000lbs. I have only heard the fan roar, no OH.
In '06 after 4" MBRP and Tx CAI all I heard was mild fan engagement while in Colorado. If I hear too much fan or experience OH, I will get a V2 w/fan.

Stay cool,

Rockfollower

[haunruh]

TxC, great video!! You say in the video those were some "killer grades"; what grade were they? Here in BC we have 9% on the major Trans Canada Hwy. One stretch is 21Km (13mi) of contiuous 6% or more grade. Try that in summer with your load!! Glad to hear you beat them. Hope my LB7 fares better with a 10,000# 5er.

[TxChristopher]

Originally Posted by haunruh

TxC, great video!! You say in the video those were some "killer grades"; what grade were they? Here in BC we have 9% on the major Trans Canada Hwy. One stretch is 21Km (13mi) of contiuous 6% or more grade. Try that in summer with your load!! Glad to hear you beat them. Hope my LB7 fares better with a 10,000# 5er.

I doubt you will have any issues with the LB7 at all. They got the cooling system right on it!

Nobody seems to mark the uphills, only the downhills as the government concern is big trucks running away. There are signs on the other side posting 6% and 7%, but the uphill is steeper than the downhill in most sections.

To me they were killer since I never tow heavy in mountanous areas, in the scheme of things they do not compare to the grades out west or up your way. I have been out west but not towing.

The length of the grade is what I was looking for, so that the truck would have to work constantly for 5 to 6 miles or more. These were the closest to me that offered any real length, a mile or two isn't long enough, they don't keep the truck churning for enough time.

As far as "killer" grades go, earlier in the day I traversed the steepest grades in Texas, which are in the Davis Mountains going up to the MacDonald Observatory. Those are 15% with a stretch of 18%, but were not long enough. They rose up a quarter mile or a half mile then would level off, and it was very very curvy, with lots of switchbacks, so that you always were having to let off. Also the speeds were so low that the truck was down in 1st and 2nd gear where it had tremendous gear multiplication helping the engine not work so hard. I was able to accelerate right up each section strongly, only to have to brake for the next tight turn. Without the speed (wind drag for my sail) and with all the help from the gearing and with having to let up every 30 seconds to 60 seconds, I could not overheat the truck, and I went back and forth three times trying. It was also cooler out up high, like 65* which is below the 70* I consider to be the lower temp limit for valuable overheat work.

The temp was flying up and down all over the place, but it was a no-go for a real overheat around the MacDonald Observatory area. Conditions conditions conditions ...... the difference between a "non-overheater" and an "overheater"

Constant work - thats the #1 requirement, take it away and you will not overheat.

.

[k9eros]

Originally Posted by swatkins

Hopalong just stay with your truck,,, If it gets hot put a V2 on it and go on with life

The rest of the truck is fine

Hopalong, I agree with Chris. The Chevrolet/GMC is the best truck wrapped around a marginal cooling system in the LLY's. If you do experience overheating just get with Chris and snag a V2, fan and CAI. You'll spend a LOT less than what you'll lose trading your truck. Your problem will be gone and you won't have to drive a Dodge just to get the engine.
Don't get me wrong, I have two Dodge cars but the GM trucks are better than the Dodges.

[TxChristopher]

I just want to cover a few things about the trailer setup in the video.

I have heard that it is being referred to as a "stunt trailer" in other places, and that it was not a legal load.

The load was completely legal in every way, from pin weight to GVWR to GCWR to height and width and length. Was it a goofy load? Sure it was, I specifically set it up to cause wind drag. Why? Because I live in a relatively flat state, there are no huge mountains with big long never ending grades anywhere close to me, they are over 1,000 miles away. On top of that, we haven't chosen to buy a 5er yet, and I wasn't going to buy one just to test if the truck would overheat or not. So I created a load that would make the engine bust ass enough to maintain speed that when it got to my smaller grades here in Texas they would seem like bigger grades. Simple enough.

Understand this: The cooling system should be designed to dissipate the heat that the engine creates, no matter if the engine is operating 100% output forever.

If it had that capability, then I would not be able to overheat it no matter the type of load put on. All I would be able to do is burn through lots of expensive fuel. My GMC Canyon has such a cooling system, I tried to overheat it and it cannot be done. It was able to tow twice its rated load being my boat and not overheat in 98* weather even dogging the crap out of it as in floored for 15 minutes at a time, the Duramax overheated with the same boat over the same road in 95* weather within 10 minutes. So a Canyon is more a towing machine than a Duramax Silverado? I think not. But many will tell you these LLY's don't have a problem.

GM sat on the truck all summer long without repairing it, it doesn't take 6 to 7 months to put in a new engine. They waited until the summer was over and the temps were mild then said try and overheat it. I was given the truck back from GM at the start of winter with temps in the 60's and 70's, with only 30 days to prove it overheated or not. This means no jacking around with 6k or 8k trailers and little hills, you find the hottest day you can and the biggest meanest hills and get the meanest load and see if it can do it or not. So I watched the predicted temps 10 days out and found the hottest days I could, which only got me lower 90's. Game on.

Is the load representative of what a "normal" person tows? Maybe, maybe not. Some tow heavier, and some tow lighter, some tow even more wind resistive loads. The GM lawyer and the GM engineer complained about it, saying it would have been better if the truck was turned around and closer to the front of the trailer, but the judge sided with us, saying that only weight is mentioned in the GM literature. On top of that the pin weight was too high with the uhaul truck towards the front of the trailer, so I was forced to move it way back so that all the numbers would be legal on the scales. Originally I had it up closer to the front, trying to more simulate towing a 5er travel trailer.

So the load was legit. End of story.

.

[turbobruce]

Originally Posted by TxChristopher

I just want to cover a few things about the trailer setup in the video.

I have heard that it is being referred to as a "stunt trailer" in other places, and that it was not a legal load.

The load was completely legal in every way, from pin weight to GVWR to GCWR to height and width and length. Was it a goofy load? Sure it was, I specifically set it up to cause wind drag. Why? Because I live in a relatively flat state, there are no huge mountains with big long never ending grades anywhere close to me, they are over 1,000 miles away. On top of that, we haven't chosen to buy a 5er yet, and I wasn't going to buy one just to test if the truck would overheat or not. So I created a load that would make the engine bust ass enough to maintain speed that when it got to my smaller grades here in Texas they would seem like bigger grades. Simple enough.

Understand this: The cooling system should be designed to dissipate the heat that the engine creates, no matter if the engine is operating 100% output forever.

If it had that capability, then I would not be able to overheat it no matter the type of load put on. All I would be able to do is burn through lots of expensive fuel. My GMC Canyon has such a cooling system, I tried to overheat it and it cannot be done. It was able to tow twice its rated load being my boat and not overheat in 98* weather even dogging the crap out of it as in floored for 15 minutes at a time, the Duramax overheated with the same boat over the same road in 95* weather within 10 minutes. So a Canyon is more a towing machine than a Duramax Silverado? I think not. But many will tell you these LLY's don't have a problem.

GM sat on the truck all summer long without repairing it, it doesn't take 6 to 7 months to put in a new engine. They waited until the summer was over and the temps were mild then said try and overheat it. I was given the truck back from GM at the start of winter with temps in the 60's and 70's, with only 30 days to prove it overheated or not. This means no jacking around with 6k or 8k trailers and little hills, you find the hottest day you can and the biggest meanest hills and get the meanest load and see if it can do it or not. So I watched the predicted temps 10 days out and found the hottest days I could, which only got me lower 90's. Game on.

Is the load representative of what a "normal" person tows? Maybe, maybe not. Some tow heavier, and some tow lighter, some tow even more wind resistive loads. The GM lawyer and the GM engineer complained about it, saying it would have been better if the truck was turned around and closer to the front of the trailer, but the judge sided with us, saying that only weight is mentioned in the GM literature. On top of that the pin weight was too high with the uhaul truck towards the front of the trailer, so I was forced to move it way back so that all the numbers would be legal on the scales. Originally I had it up closer to the front, trying to more simulate towing a 5er travel trailer.

So the load was legit. End of story.

.

The guy who called it a stunt trailer is an asshole and I have argued with him on this whole overheat thing for months. He thinks just because his does not overheat in South Carolina that no llys overheat. Your trailer was defended by Rick and myself a few times

[swatkins]

That load was fine... It was no different that my 5th wheel. In fact it was even easier because the truck was a full 8" lower than my trailer is!

[turbobruce]

Originally Posted by swatkins

That load was fine... It was no different that my 5th wheel. In fact it was even easier because the truck was a full 8" lower than my trailer is!

You should post your pic of your rig on that posting over at the other place.

[TxChristopher]

The wind resistance down the SIDE of a long 5er is another thing people miss. If you have a wind blowing toward you at an angle, the force of that wind is applied to the side of the trailer and results in a rearward force that the truck will have to overcome. Since we are talking about a massive area, it can be quite a force. I didn't have as much of that with the uhaul, but I likely made up for it in raw dirty frontal area.

.